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A New Direction for Liberal America

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  • A New Direction for Liberal America

    As I had stated in another thread, the recent SCOTUS decision to send abortion and reproductive rights back to States, may end up being the much needed jar to head of liberal America…. why are we exhausting ourselves fighting a fight that we will never win? Why are people who value education, technology, science, progress in general fighting an ideological holy war? What do we hope to win by changing heart and minds, that aren’t interested in changing?

    Why not focus our energies on places that are already economic and cultural juggernauts, and in turn why not work together and form liberal co-operatives… just because it’s not geographically convenient, doesn’t mean we can’t work together to establish best practices, form progressive policies, share resources and work in a complimentary way so we ALL improve… California, Oregon, Colorado and Washington work in tandem to design and build a democratic state that provides for the future of anybody who wants to be part of it.

    Look, let Red America do what they want. Why are we fighting with people who want to live by faith and belief, and other considerations are a distant second…. Mississippi, Alabama, Oklahoma, Kansas, among other States… why do we continue to engage in this losing fight? We need to let them go. Ohio, Indiana, Carolina, Virginia, let those places decide if they want to be more about the future, or more about the past…

    You don’t win by trying to impose your will/ ideology on people… we have tried doing that for generations, it’s time to stop. put Liberal states in hyper-drive offering a better life, and let people chose if they want to stay in States that are stagnant with crumbling roads.

    Blue States aren’t without their problems, but if we focus our energies locally versus nationally, maybe we can actually fix some of them…

    Democrats should be about reducing the size and scope or Federal Power…. Healthcare, Education, Retirement, Welfare, Voting Access/ Voting Right, Women’s Health, Gay Rights can be done better without it. It’s time to put together an ambitious, optimistic plan together for Blue America.

    Please share your ideas. Polis moving to secure Women's Right last week inspired me to begin to think about how great Colorado really is right now.

  • #2
    Lmao

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by B-Large View Post
      As I had stated in another thread, the recent SCOTUS decision to send abortion and reproductive rights back to States, may end up being the much needed jar to head of liberal America…. why are we exhausting ourselves fighting a fight that we will never win? Why are people who value education, technology, science, progress in general fighting an ideological holy war? What do we hope to win by changing heart and minds, that aren’t interested in changing?

      Why not focus our energies on places that are already economic and cultural juggernauts, and in turn why not work together and form liberal co-operatives… just because it’s not geographically convenient, doesn’t mean we can’t work together to establish best practices, form progressive policies, share resources and work in a complimentary way so we ALL improve… California, Oregon, Colorado and Washington work in tandem to design and build a democratic state that provides for the future of anybody who wants to be part of it.

      Look, let Red America do what they want. Why are we fighting with people who want to live by faith and belief, and other considerations are a distant second…. Mississippi, Alabama, Oklahoma, Kansas, among other States… why do we continue to engage in this losing fight? We need to let them go. Ohio, Indiana, Carolina, Virginia, let those places decide if they want to be more about the future, or more about the past…

      You don’t win by trying to impose your will/ ideology on people… we have tried doing that for generations, it’s time to stop. put Liberal states in hyper-drive offering a better life, and let people chose if they want to stay in States that are stagnant with crumbling roads.

      Blue States aren’t without their problems, but if we focus our energies locally versus nationally, maybe we can actually fix some of them…

      Democrats should be about reducing the size and scope or Federal Power…. Healthcare, Education, Retirement, Welfare, Voting Access/ Voting Right, Women’s Health, Gay Rights can be done better without it. It’s time to put together an ambitious, optimistic plan together for Blue America.

      Please share your ideas. Polis moving to secure Women's Right last week inspired me to begin to think about how great Colorado really is right now.
      I don’t think you have ever typed this much. Ever.

      I like power to the states because people get to decide. In my view, the biblical and conservative values win. Let there be states that do it the liberal way and states that are conservative. Get the Federal Government out of things they have no business in.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Shellback88 View Post

        I don’t think you have ever typed this much. Ever.

        I like power to the states because people get to decide. In my view, the biblical and conservative values win. Let there be states that do it the liberal way and states that are conservative. Get the Federal Government out of things they have no business in.
        it took me forever to type that much... LOL.

        You know Shelly, you had posted many moons ago in an abortion thread that it should go back to the States, and let the people decide... the more I thought about it, long before the SCOTUS brief, I started to come around to it being the way to go. I envision a place with true religious freedom across the board, universal access to healthcare for anyone who wants it, and an educational environment that produces the best and brightest as we compete in the global economy. Inclusivity versus Exclusivity. Values diversity of human existence across all races and ethnicities.

        That isn't going to happen in the South, Midwest, Rust Belt. So why keep trying to make it? Why keep pretending we have common ground?

        If I'm a betting man, I'm putting my money on Blue States- they're the economic drivers, heck Cali is the 5th largest economy in the world. Dismantle the programs at the Federal Level that bind us as a Nation, Medicare, Medicaid, among other items and let States do it themselves. Then we can say Conservative America can truly stand on it own, Blue American can do the same, and let the pieces fall where they may.

        No malice, everybody loves happier.





        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by B-Large View Post

          it took me forever to type that much... LOL.

          You know Shelly, you had posted many moons ago in an abortion thread that it should go back to the States, and let the people decide... the more I thought about it, long before the SCOTUS brief, I started to come around to it being the way to go. I envision a place with true religious freedom across the board, universal access to healthcare for anyone who wants it, and an educational environment that produces the best and brightest as we compete in the global economy. Inclusivity versus Exclusivity. Values diversity of human existence across all races and ethnicities.

          That isn't going to happen in the South, Midwest, Rust Belt. So why keep trying to make it? Why keep pretending we have common ground?

          If I'm a betting man, I'm putting my money on Blue States- they're the economic drivers, heck Cali is the 5th largest economy in the world. Dismantle the programs at the Federal Level that bind us as a Nation, Medicare, Medicaid, among other items and let States do it themselves. Then we can say Conservative America can truly stand on it own, Blue American can do the same, and let the pieces fall where they may.

          No malice, everybody loves happier.




          Well, we agree in a way. Let it all go to the states and through fair elections let people decide. You want gambling, marijuana, abortion, gay marriage, etc.

          I believe in biblical values, I believe in conservatism and agriculture.

          It’s a kind of agree to disagree type scenario that allows a price up and choice for people. Hate your state? Move.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Shellback88 View Post

            Well, we agree in a way. Let it all go to the states and through fair elections let people decide. You want gambling, marijuana, abortion, gay marriage, etc.

            I believe in biblical values, I believe in conservatism and agriculture.

            It’s a kind of agree to disagree type scenario that allows a price up and choice for people. Hate your state? Move.
            I agree completely....

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by B-Large View Post

              I agree completely....
              Let’s get rid of politicians, this is too easy!

              Comment


              • #8
                Can we make it a condition that the Theocratic States of America no longer receive any tax revenues or economic aid of any kind from the U.S. federal government?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by L.A. BRONCOS FAN View Post
                  Can we make it a condition that the Theocratic States of America no longer receive any tax revenues or economic aid of any kind from the U.S. federal government?
                  I think that’s why you disassemble Medicare, Medicaid, SS, etc among many other things….. it can done, and red America will be in a very hard spot when they no longer get subsidized by prosperous blue states.

                  I think we start with Medicare. Cut off the old white boomers who draw off the system, let them buy an individual plan. Decouple Blue States from Red States from any healthcare perspective, those people are gigantic and are gonna bankrupt themselves with heart disease, Diabetes, etc.

                  Time to break it up, Blue States have nothing to gain by being United anymore…
                  Last edited by B-Large; 05-05-2022, 06:30 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Shellback88 View Post

                    Let’s get rid of politicians, this is too easy!
                    Free for all! 😂👍

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Break It Up: Secession, Division, and the Secret History of America's Imperfect Union https://www.amazon.com/dp/0316510602...PHDSGX4856QE51

                      Usually this is brought up hyperbolically, but perhaps it’s time to serious think about dispensing with then Union. I couldn’t care less if broke up, I think Liberal America would be well served by it. Hope this is a good read.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Shellback88 View Post
                        I believe in biblical values, I believe in conservatism and agriculture.
                        If your values are the same as your bible’s values, well, your bible is crap. For yet another reason.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          This thread really warms my heart. A lot of problems with polarization are the all or nothing mentality. And both sides wanting to shove their values down the other sides throat. Cuz By God I’m right and you’re wrong.

                          I’d prefer straight up Balkanization as the best solution, but it can’t happen until after the collapse of the government. So if you strip the federal government down to only being responsible for like 20 essential things, that could work too.

                          Though that probably can’t happen till after a collapse as well.

                          But yeah B-Large, spread the word. Only thing, if you’re trying to get right wingers to your side, use an argument that appeals to them. It’s not that hard. Use the abortion issue. Or guns or Jesus or capitalism. Or just say “I want you to be able to live in a place that represents your values. But I also want the same thing for myself.”

                          You should just hope to get as many people on both sides to agree to this. Because it would be overwhelmingly best for everyone. I’d vote for any politician that is for a form of what you proposed. Even if I hate everything else they say.

                          Glad you’re on board to my way of thinking. 👍🏿
                          Last edited by spdirty; 05-05-2022, 07:49 AM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by W*GS View Post

                            If your values are the same as your bible’s values, well, your bible is crap. For yet another reason.
                            Well, vote and live in a state of your choosing.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Shellback88 View Post

                              Well, vote and live in a state of your choosing.
                              You can move to Iran, with all the other theocrats.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by W*GS View Post

                                You can move to Iran, with all the other theocrats.
                                You first.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by Shellback88 View Post
                                  You first.
                                  Iran already has the fusion of state and faith you want. Ready to go for you.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by W*GS View Post

                                    Iran already has the fusion of state and faith you want. Ready to go for you.
                                    Just pure ignorance Wiggy. But that’s your ‘norm’

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by Shellback88 View Post
                                      Just pure ignorance Wiggy. But that’s your ‘norm’
                                      How is noting Iran's status as a theocracy therefore "ignorance" on my part?

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by W*GS View Post

                                        How is noting Iran's status as a theocracy therefore "ignorance" on my part?
                                        You should focus on China's theocracy. Both more dangerous and more familiar to you.

                                        Comment


                                        • #21
                                          Originally posted by BroncoBeavis View Post
                                          You should focus on China's theocracy. Both more dangerous and more familiar to you.
                                          Trying to save Shelly from his own idiocy isn't a good look for you.

                                          Comment


                                          • #22
                                            Originally posted by W*GS View Post

                                            Trying to save Shelly from his own idiocy isn't a good look for you.
                                            To be fair, your faith is much closer to China's than Shelly's is to Iran's. Maybe you should evaluate a move?

                                            Comment


                                            • #23
                                              Originally posted by BroncoBeavis View Post

                                              You should focus on China's theocracy. Both more dangerous and more familiar to you.
                                              Theocracy and Communism end up in the same exact place, both hatched from the same fundamentalist mindset.

                                              tell me the last Theocratic State that didn’t end is disaster. Tell me the last Community regime that didn’t end in disaster.

                                              One based on myth, another on lies. But get you to the same place.

                                              Comment


                                              • #24
                                                Originally posted by B-Large View Post

                                                Theocracy and Communism end up in the same exact place, both hatched from the same fundamentalist mindset.

                                                tell me the last Theocratic State that didn’t end is disaster. Tell me the last Community regime that didn’t end in disaster.

                                                One based on myth, another on lies. But get you to the same place.
                                                We agree... as did our founders for the most part.

                                                What Wags doesn't see is that freedom of faith and freedom 'from' faith are ultimately incompatible.

                                                Comment


                                                • #25
                                                  Originally posted by BroncoBeavis View Post

                                                  We agree... as did our founders for the most part.

                                                  What Wags doesn't see is that freedom of faith and freedom 'from' faith are ultimately incompatible.
                                                  I get your point.

                                                  To be honest, its really on you and people like you to be the bulwark as fundamentalists try to establish a state religion. Will enough conservatives pump the brakes and begin to think of the repercussions of this, or is constitutional conservatism in the end a myth, and has been a guise to cover as we move to quasi theocracy…

                                                  im nervous about that question

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